fixing a flat flute

    
fixing a flat flute    20:40 on Saturday, July 16, 2005          
(Sarah)
Posted by Archived posts

I am an amateur who just bought a used flute- haven`t played since my student days 13 years ago. I bought it for recreational purposes only.

This may be a dumb question, but I`ll ask it anyways. The B-flat is out of tune- it is the only note that sounds flat once the flute is tuned, and I`ve fiddled with my flute to correct it but it`s still off. Is this a problem with the flute or is there something I can do?


Re: fixing a flat flute    21:19 on Saturday, July 16, 2005          
(Scott)
Posted by Archived posts

It is most likely just you if this is the only flat note that you see. My low Bb is a little flat too. You can blow more air on just this note or you can aim your air stream a little higher but just for this note since it`s the only note you`re flat on.


Re: fixing a flat flute    01:53 on Sunday, July 17, 2005          
(Piko)
Posted by Archived posts

Leaving off your right pinkie and either using the Bb Thumb key or Bb Aux key are alternative fingerings that will slightly raise the pitch of Bb. You should give yourself some time to become one with your flute and check again in a week or so as you may correct/support your Bb yourself now that you are aware of it.


Re: fixing a flat flute    08:58 on Sunday, July 17, 2005          
(Sarah)
Posted by Archived posts

Thanks for these tips, which I will try. Could you tell me what the B flat thumb key or an auxiliary fingering is?

Thanks again!


Re: fixing a flat flute    12:04 on Sunday, July 17, 2005          
(Bilbo)
Posted by Archived posts

It could be that there is a bind in the mechanism.

When you finger the Bb, your left thumb. -Thumb Bb (to the left) or B natural key (to the right) is used. If thumb b natural key is used the right hand index goes down and the right hand Pinkey(D# key).

100/ 000 D#
tBb

100 /400 D#
t

Hope those fingering schematics appear ok.

Important point:
What ever fingering you use for Bb. your first finger should go down and the key next to it that you don`t put any finger on will be down for the Bb. This key is BETWEEN your left index and the second finger. That`s normal BUT if the left-hand second finger key (the A key) moves down on it`s own when you finger the Bb, there may be a bind and the Bb will sound flat. Also, any keys that don`t raise up high enough will make bad tones. If so, have the repairman check it out.
~Bilbo


Re: fixing a flat flute    15:37 on Sunday, July 17, 2005          
(Piko)
Posted by Archived posts

Bb Thumb Fingering -
Finger a regular Bb and look at your left hand thumb there is another key you can use instead of the regular thumb. That extra key allows you to play a Bb while releasing your right index finger.

The Bb thumb fingering comes in really handy for certain fast changes and whether or not you should use it as your default Bb fingering is really personal choice. There is certainly a different hand position needed if you use Bb Thumb on a regular basis. Bb thumb can be used for all notes except the highest F# and it can be tricky switching from Bb thumb to B natural in fast passages.

Bb Aux Fingering -
Same effect as above. If you look to the left of your right hand index finger there is a key there that if you depress along with your left index and regular Bb thumb you will achieve a Bb without using the F key.



Using alternative fingerings    11:12 on Monday, July 18, 2005          
(Sarah)
Posted by Archived posts

This is so enlightening! Thank you all. The B flat sounds much better with the the Bflat key rather than the standard fingering. Also, your lessons helped re-orient me to the uses of all the keys on my flute including the little one to the left of my right index finger.

Now you have awakened my curiosity. Do most professional flute players use these "non standard" fingerings regularly?

And what about F sharp- I looked at some alternative fingerings which sound much better to me but are more awkward to play- do you sacrifice comfort for sound?


Re: fixing a flat flute    19:21 on Monday, July 18, 2005          
(Arak)
Posted by Archived posts

Have you checked yet whether the `A` key remains FULLY open when you do the standard Bb fingering? Like it is supposed to? If it does not, then your problem is that the A key`s pivot tube is binding.

It would not be a good idea to get in a habit of always using the alternate fingerings.


Re: fixing a flat flute    21:55 on Monday, July 18, 2005          
(Bilbo)
Posted by Archived posts

Arak. SOunds like this flute has some issues with adjustments in the 1&1 Bb and the F# linkages. Not sure but I think that when it was said that a note sounds flat, they might have meant sharp actually.

Now as for sacrificing fingerings for tone. It depends upon the speed of the notes, If slow, tone and tuning is everything. If at all possible, this is a general guide but some players use "sensitive fingerings" Aka cheat fingerings for certain notes. As an example, some finger the top line F# as :
123/050 D#
T

I don`t think that all flutes sound very good on that note with that fingering. It`s OK for doing a trill from E to F# but for just about anything else, I use:
1234/ 006 D#
T

~Bilbo


Re: fixing a flat flute    22:39 on Monday, July 18, 2005          
(kippsix)
Posted by Archived posts

I was taught the "alternative" b flat fingering from day one. Of course my instructor was Sister Mary Jean, and I was eight years old.....It`s the only fingering I have ever used (with very rare exception)! Am I the only one?


Re: fixing a flat flute    00:42 on Tuesday, July 19, 2005          
(Piko)
Posted by Archived posts

My flute instructor forced me to use Bb thumb as a primary fingering. Personally I prefer it to be secondary for difficult passages even though it is more in tune by its nature. The Bb thumb key can be dangerous while site reading music the orchestra pit... unless of course you use a pencil and prepare use regular Bb when you encounter B naturals and F#`s.
Even then it`s easier to switch to the Bb Thumb than vice versa.

I`ve never used the Bb Aux on the right hand except special occaisions... usually the highest Bb trill to B natural. Gives it more clarity.

Larry Krantz has an article on the different Bb fingerings:
http://www.larrykrantz.com/bbf.htm


Re: fixing a flat flute    00:47 on Tuesday, July 19, 2005          
(Piko)
Posted by Archived posts

Here`s a guy that prefers the Bb Aux to all others:
http://www.fluteinfo.com/Doc/Shake/index.html


Re: fixing a flat flute    05:21 on Tuesday, July 19, 2005          
(Bilbo)
Posted by Archived posts

I use and teach both Bbs-all three actually. My selection is based on the fingering difficulty.
Some may say that one sounds better because of the difference in the overtone partial mix but this greatly depends on the flute as to whether or not you can actually hear any difference in the fingerings and even then they say that the 1&1 Bb is better. I disagree because to my ear the TBb more mtches the tone quality of the surrounding notes such as A and b nat.
~Bilbo
Piko, your link is not accessable here.


Re: fixing a flat flute    15:59 on Tuesday, July 19, 2005          
(Piko)
Posted by Archived posts

That`s weird the links are working fine for me here at work... I posted from home. If you just copied them into you browser they should go.

I don`t really notice much difference in the tone of the different Bb fingering mainly because I compensate for my regular Bb, but on the Bb-B natural trill the clarity is really noticable when you use the Bb Aux key... at least for me.


Re: fixing a flat flute    20:42 on Tuesday, July 19, 2005          
(Bilbo)
Posted by Archived posts

That clarity Piko could be because of a minute linkage issue. Normally if a flute is going to play brighter, it would be on the 1&1 Bb and not the other two fingerings. This is because the partials of the overtone series are stronger on the fingering that uses the F key. I think it is either the first harmonic or the second one that stands out a bit more. I have one flute where this is somewhat noticeable. The other two, not so much.
~Bilbo


   




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