i'm tired of making thread after thread to ask questions and other random things (been doing that too often lately) so now, i'm just gonna put my general questions here.

I'm gonna audition for an orchestra around spring time, where my friend is the only bassoonist. she said that i'd probably end up playing 2nd bassoon and i was wondering, what kind of parts 2nd bassoon gets in orchestra.

In most cases the 2nd bassoon will play almost the same part as the 1st bassoon but everything will be down an octave, third , fifth, or something like that. The 2nd bassoon often will play a simplier part or just whole notes while the 1st bassoon will have amore complicated or melodic line. Being second bassoon also, obviously, means you won't be playing the solos or principal parts. You will be more likely to play counter melodies and the like rather than the melodies. None of this is a bad thing and being second bassoon would be great fun. Best of luck!

But lots of threads makes us look like a busier forum! :p

It's good to remember if you're playing 2nd bassoon that your part is still important. You're there to make the 1st bassoon look good, to support that part. So playing second isn't a bad thing.
However, the parts tend to not be as interesting - if there's a solo or a very exposed phrase then it will almost always go to first (though, it's not unheard of to go to 2nd - in Rach's 2nd piano concerto there are a couple of v.important phrases in 2nd bassoon)
1st bassoon also gets all the top notes, so if you're a fan of the bottom octave of the bassoon then 2nd is the part you want.
I'm just backing up what someone else said here, but the 2nd part isn't always that different. Usually in unison or octaves. A lot of orchestral music doesn't give much melody to the bassoon anyway so there are lots of pieces where you just contribute to a chord - 2nd bassoon will normally have the root of the chord, so that's very important also (and easier than playing the third)
So basically... just don't expect any solos. Do you know what pieces this orchestra is playing?

Just a thought - what kind of orchestra is this? a Youth orchestra? If you have to audition this might not be an option, but in my youth orchestra they always tried to be fair and swapped the first parts between the players. Maybe you could ask if your friend could play 1st in one piece, and you play 1st in the second. This keeps everyone happy, and is very benefitial to your playing.

this is a youth orchestra. i don't really mind playing second, as long as i have a chance to play. this year, i don't really care too much to play first. i was basically just curious, because i wanted something that was sorta, kinda challenging, but not too much so, because i only started not too long ago. but for the amount of time i've been playing, i've been moving along at a good pace. As long as i get a chance to play with my friend, and perform on the bassoon, i'm fine. next year, i might end up having to work harder when she graduates, if no one else auditions. and, she's been playing/taking lessons for 5 years, and i've been playingfor 6 months, so like i said, i'm not too concerned about what part i'm playing.

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and i have a question about reeds. my reeds are playing pretty flat right now (and one of them is soo flat, that it's almost a half step lower than the note it's supposed to be). One reed is also very buzzy and bright. How can i fix this?

oh ok, well in that case it's probably best that you're on 2nd, maybe for the first year while your friend is there - then you might be given 1st all to yourself! Playing in an orchestra after 6 months is very impressive, i didn't play in an orchestra until i'd been playing two years. What music will you be playing? Unless it's been arranged to be simpler, you'll probably have enough on your plate with second until you have that familiarity with most of the bassoons range - it's not like wind bands where the bassoon gets um-pah stuff, there can be really tricky passages, I think you're pretty brave! It's brilliant that you're doing it though, let us know how you get on with it.

As for the reeds - are they new? It's kinda hard to know what's wrong with them without seeing them, as you know. With the flat one, it could just be dying. Or sometimes, when you make a new reed, you have to trim the tip of the reed (minimally) to get it vaguely in tune - u can usually tell if you try to lip down the E below middle C, because you should be able to lip it quite far without it dropping suddenly. Might not be though! As for the other one, the reed could be too thick, or the wires could be poorly adjusted.

I suggest you just mess around with the wires - whatever you do you can easily put back, so don't worry about taking the wires too far unless the cane is about to crack. Be sure that you've improved the reed as much as possible by adjusting the wires before you do any chopping or scraping! And like i said, it's hard to tell if you can't see the reed, and even if i could see it i'm not even close to being an expert, so get someone elses opinion before doing anything drastic.

Wow, you're moving a lot faster than I did when I started on the bassoon. Best of luck!

Reeds, as I'm sure you're well aware of, can be a total pain!

As a simple rule, a round tube on the reed will darken the tone and a flat tube will brighten the tone. Also, make sure that the wires are tight. A weak spine can cause a bright tone as can cane that is to hard, or just harder than you are used to. A buzzy tone may be caused by a leak (easily checked by sealing the reed, it should take a second or two before it "pops" open again).

Compressing the sides of the reed (on either wire) should make the tone sharper, or just for fun you could play everything a half step higher the it is written! Other things that can help a flat reed is to cut the tip or tighten the top wire.

These are only suggestions, things that I've noticed, been told, or picked up from things that I've read, and I haven't tried all of them. But hopefully they will be of some assistance. The best thing you can to for your reeds, and for that matter your playing, is to try to take some lessons from a talented bassoonist. Try talking with the first bassoon, she might be of some help.

Keep us informed of how things go and have fun!

actually, when i audtition, i'll be closer to having played for a year, so i'll be a little further along than i am now.

i'm pretty sure my reed problems have a lot to do with wires. I'm using store-bought because I don't know of any bassoonists around here that can make reeds for me. So far, I've been stuck with La Voz. I've heard that Jones is a pretty good reed, but I haven't had a chance to use them. So has anyone had any good experiences with a certain brand of reeds that i may be able to get in the US?

If find playing 2nd bassoon can be fun - & generally much less stressful than 1st (contra bassoon even better from that point of view - but you must be prepared for lots of bar/measure counting). But as others have said you can get all sorts of things thrown at you - solo passages in thirds & sixths with the first, short solo passages & fugal bits where the 2nd enters first.

Sometimes the 2nd parts are harder than the first - one movement of the Mozart Requiem comes to mind where the second has a long section of semi-quavers (1/16ths) while the 1st floats above. Then there are passages where the two are in octaves leaving the lower part roaring away at the bottom end with fast C#s D#s, F#s & G#s - all thumbs & little fingers - which are relatively easy for the 1st. The greatest responsibility is when playing bass lines - the 2nd bassoon must play in tune as the rest of the woodwind tend to build their tuning on the bass & if you're sharp or flat - or worse still variable - you can unsettle the whole section.

Go for it & have fun - leave the stress of the flashy solos for later!

There is nothing wrong with store-bought reeds, particularly at your stage of playing. The trouble with them is that since they are not finished by hand, you won't get uniformity. So one day you will buy a reed that will work great for you, and the next one you buy from the same company will be awful, too hard or soft, etc. Jones has a pretty good reputation and you should try them before kicking the "store bought" habit. If you want to splash out, there are people who hand make reeds and sell them commercially. Scott Vigder is one who comes to mind. Paul Buttemer in Canada is another. I get my reeds from someone who makes them by hand, but I also have in my case a Jones that works great and I'm playing on right now, a Meason which is ANCIENT and won't last through 3 hours of playing at a time but which has a great tone, so I keep it for short bursts of playing. I also have a Soloist (think they were made by Selmer but not sure - that's how old this one is) which also works great for me if I don't overuse it. So it's not an exact science. We bassoonists waste a lot of money finding the perfect reed! It's amazing how long you can make reeds last if you have several, keep your reed case open to the air all the time except when you have to transport it somewhere, and use different reeds every day. The Meason reed I spoke of earlier is probably older than you are.

ok,can anyone tell me anything about a brand of reeds called "Meason"?

O.K. See my previous post, wherein I said I had one and was playing on one. They, like any other store-bought brand, can vary. I don't know how to tell you which brand is best; unfortunately you have to buy a few (and waste a bit of money perhaps) and see which kind suits you.

Ok, one of my reeds gives me a very good sound, and allows me to play much louder than what i've been able to (i never could quite get that full, robust sound), but it's so buzzy. I've tried working with the wires, but since i don't really know what i'm doing, you know...not really much that i did helped. What can i do for this?

BTW-does anyone know what "commodo" or "patetico" means? both words in my weissenborn book that have been tearing me apart!

second bassoon parts!

try just making sure the wires are tight, or soak the neck of the reed to make sure it's not leaking air.

Commodo - comfortably fast
Patetico - to perform the manner with great emotion.

Look on online music dictionarys