In a previous post, a member (I think jose_luis) was concerned about "plugs".

All I can tell you is that which I've gleaned from previous instructors (symphony men and women)--- and very talented amateurs, regarding "To plug or not to plug".

The (late) Elaine Schaeffer, a great flute teacher and wonderful flutist probably said it best: "You sink or you swim".

She meant, obviously, that you can NOT "cheat" by plugging ANY hole in a French model flute. This opinion was endorsed by my first "serious" teacher, Phil Kaplan, former: BSO.

This "argument" will continue to rage on and on, as the opionions of pedagogues and professionals seem to be split, "50/50".

Regarding, specifically, the French model in-line G --- the "G" is treacherous, and can be very uncomfortable for most flutists (particularly younger flutists).

However, keep one thing in mind: IF you "cheat" (and I used to) by plugging up (any-given key), you run the risk of developing "bad fingering" habits. So--- what happens when you "finally" remove the plug? Your bad fingering habits will come back to haunt you. And, you're back to "sqaure one".

IF you bought a French model flute, with in an in-line G --- then PLAY IT. As a youngster in my mid-teens, I transitioned from a Plateau flute to a French model. I had to "sink or swim". Guess what -- it only took me a few days to reach all of the "holes". Granted, I'm a male, with large, long fingers --- but that doesn't matter. One of the greatest flutists of all time is Doriot Anthony Dwyer, former Principal flutist of the Boston Symphony. And guess what SHE plays --- and has ALWAYS played? That's right. A French model flute with an in-line G. Even with her "small hands". IF SHE can do it --- so can YOU! And, NO, you will not develop "tennis elbow", "capel tunnel syndrome", etc.

As another one of my other teachers said: "It's only a matter of reaching a millimeter or so".

IF you're going to "cheat" and put plugs in the holes, then WHY did you buy a French model.? Just PLAY the darned thing, and you'll "get it".

Regards, Jim Millen

Jim, by the logic you've followed, alternate fingerings, gadgets such as synthetic corks, options like the C# trill or Split E, etc. would all be cheating. There's nothing wrong with plugging only one (or some) of the holes on an open hole flute. Brannen, one of the top US makers of US flutes recently introduced the Albert Cooper Orchestral model with Plateau keys in the left hand and French keys in the right. This is absolutely the top of the line flute, designed especially for flutists in major symphony orchestras, so clearly there is nothing wrong with plugging the G key. We've already established that you got at least SOME faulty information from past instructors, regardless of how well-respected they were as performers, so it would probably be best to take anything else you gleaned from them with a large grain of salt.

In any case, if the stretch of an Inline G flute (unplugged) is such that you experience any kind of pain or excess tension, then you could very well end up with serious playing-related injuries that could influence many parts of your life aside from music. Playing an Inline (or offset for that matter) flute with all the keys unplugged just so you can say you play with the keys unplugged makes despite pain is just asking for trouble.

Hand conformation varies widely from person to person, and not everyone gets good results playing in the academic's "correct" position (fingers in the centers of the keys). Some will have a much more fluid, even technique if they play on one edge or another of the key cup, while some will need to go so far as to have extensions put on keys so that they can create a comfortable and reliable hand position for themselves. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Take a look at Jeanne Baxtresser's flute sometime if you disagree. Clearly she is a fantastic flutist, but her instrument is covered in extensions and modifications. What is theoretically correct does not apply to everyone everywhere....You have to be flexible enough to accept that a slightly "abnormal" hand position may actually yield much better results for some folks. In the end, you have to do whatever is necessary to get what you want out of the instrument....If that means plugging holes, given that there is no acoustic, intonation, or tone benefit to leaving them open, then go for it.

On a side note, please try to contain your responses to the original thread. If you have a new idea that you'd like to discuss, by all means start a new thread, but by responding to someone else's post in an entirely new thread, it just means that the information becomes more scattered, and we all have to work harder (particularly those who aren't around when the posts go up....I.E. future readers) to figure out what's going on, and pull all the information together.

Jeanne Baxtresser has an offset g Haynes, with a plugged g key with an extender on it...

I guess my tendinitis,carpal tunnel and short fingers make is so I have to cheat. Either that or special order a closed hole flute from Powell. If I listened to every well known flutists or top notch professional and did everything they claim is correct then I would be so stressed and never get any type of comfortable playing time in. I do enjoy hearing some of these pros rattle out of their .....

The most important thing here is discussing this issue -or any issue- in a friendly manner and avoiding personal attacks.

I had posted about my concern of unplugging holes and the added difficulties in a different thread.

But the reason I was giving is my interest to correct wrong finger positions, particularly the RH ring finger that is giving me troubles with the "D". My post was not related at all with the possible technical or artistic advantages of using the French flute "as is", without any plug.

Of course everybody is free to expand any thread into new aspects or even far-related issues; it has been a fairly frequent case in the almost two years I have been visiting this nice Forum.

But keep it nice, please!

i have a french keyed flute and i pulg most the holes simply becauser i am a beginner with some bad habits (liek putting my fingers high abe the keys) i am able to play with all the the plugs out and i do play with the g and the one above it unplugged but i have a offset g does that mean i am cheating i i think not and my flute teacher doesn't think so in fact she said untill i kick out my bad finger habit i should keep the plugs in so i can makesure i get the sound out but just because you plug a hol;e so it is more comfitable or so you can play easier doesn't mena you are cheating it means you are playing comfitable with out risking an injury which could put you out of action for a while

don't worry about unplugging the holes if you are comfortable with them that was then that is fine and your teacher should not push it unplugging the holes is not nussesary even for an advances flutist who may own a gold silver metalic orange or green flute in which they might have bought at walmart but i dought that they bought the gold one there unless it was one of those sandblasted ugly ones and then they are not really gold but fake like spray painted why dont they just take a can of glitter spray and coat it that would be more interesting and put some holes in it to or add a split e or how about a b flat foot do you see how hard this post was to read without any though of puncuation not fun is it

OH MY GOD, IM ABOUT TO SCREAM!

dont EVER write a post like that again!!!!

And by the way, i have a thumbport because i have carpal tunnel, severe arthritis, and extremely long fingers. carpal tunnel and arthritis some days to the point where i cant write, play, or even pick up a fork to eat. because i cant hold anything makes me a cheater?
this isnt 6th grade where were being graded on how we play the flute. another question: i play out of the side of my mouth due to dental issues. does this make me a bad flutist since im not playing in the direct center?

To Plug or Not to plug.

This topic has been brought up over and over, and is truly an interesting one.

Open Holes and blisters

When I play for hours and hours, sometimes I have been known to play for 6-8 hours at time (drinks of water and short breaks of course), in sessions, and in the studio. I will develope a blister on my left hand right where the flute rests on the top (near my hand) of my index finger. I know why they don't put an open hole on the index finger...no one could keep the leaks out! Maybe they could not hold onto the flute effectively, or the blisters would be !****!! Mine sometimes are if I play for long periods of time. Has anyone here ever had to play for ridiculous long periods of time, and had similiar issues?

I did a session in 1995 that went for 14 hours. I was literally bleeding on my index finger after the blister popped, and had to put on a bandaid. After years of playing I now have a callous there but if I play more than 3 hours at a time, I will start to get a blister still.

What does this have to do with open holes? Everything and Nothing. I played a closed hole, and still got blisters, I have played offset G keys, and in line. I still got em. I have to wonder, what the heck! Am I the only one who bleeds when he plays?

Clearly, the open hole flute and posture of the finger makes very little difference in some hand problems like mine. I am not going to change it now, it is something I have learned to live with, and it's funny my lip doesn't bleed, and I push really hard into my chin when I play. Another flutist who found little benefit from playing open holed flutes, but so as to not look uncool, I play only french style open holed flutes. (Isn't the french part = to open holed)

This of course leads to a joke...which I have to tell because it is Halloween!

"The Ghost with the 3 Bloody Fingers!"

There was this old Hotel in the far reaches of the wilderness, and it was reported to be haunted. People would visit it though, hoping to see a ghost or something creepy. It was in 1968 that the ghost made it's most notorious appearance. There was a group of people staying in the hotel in various rooms that night. There was a doctor, a lawyer, a salesman, and a hippie.

The ghost first approached the doctor shortly after midnight in his room.

"I am the ghost with the 3 !****! fingers!", came the ghosts cry!

The doctor dove out the window and jumped in his car and left scare out of his wits! Then the ghost approached the lawyer.

"I am the ghost with the 3 !****! fingers!" came the ghosts cry once again.

The lawyer grabbed his briefcase, and ran out the door, screaming how he was going to sue the hotel! Next the ghost came upon the salesman.

"I am the ghost with the 3 !****! fingers!" cried the ghost.

The salesman took one look at the apparition, and saw nothing but death, and fear in it's face. He screamed and ran out the door leaving everything behind, even his sales samples.
Then the ghost cam upon the hippie.

"I am the ghost with the 3 !****! fingers!" cried the ghost.

"Man oh man, you need bandaids!" said the hippie calmly.

(The End)

Yeah that is the punch line! Tomorrow learn about the ghost with the big green eye!



<Added>

Ok, i can't believe they are censoring the word "bloody". It's being censored by the algorithym on this site. Too funny!

The joke is lame, it's just a silly joke!

You are not right (me shakes head!) That was funny though. I think that I need to go rent a scay movie now.

<Added>

Oops... I meant scary movie.

i dont get it...

A Zen joke?

Did somebody say Zen jokes?

So the Zen master steps up to the hot dog cart and says: "Make me one with everything."

The hot dog vendor fixes a hot dog and hands it to the Zen master, who pays with a $20 bill.

The hot dog vendor puts the bill in the cash drawer and closes the drawer.

"Where's my change?" asks the Zen master.

The hot dog vendor responds: "Change must come from within."



1. Do not walk behind me, for I may not lead. Do not walk ahead of me, for I may not follow. Do not walk beside me, either; just leave me the hell alone.

2. The journey of a thousand miles begins with a broken fan belt and a leaky tire.

3. It's always darkest before dawn. So if you're going to steal your neighbor's newspaper, that's the time to do it.

4. Don't be irreplaceable; if you can't be replaced, you can't be promoted.

5. No one is listening until you make a mistake.

6. Always remember you're unique, just like everyone else.

7. Never test the depth of the water with both feet.

8. It may be that your sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others.

9. It is far more impressive when others discover your good qualities without your help.

10. If you think nobody cares if you're alive, try missing a couple of car payments.

11. Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes.

12. If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you.

13. Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day. Teach him how to fish, and he will sit in a boat & drink beer all day.

14. If you lend someone $20, and never see that person again, it was probably worth it.

15. Don't squat with your spurs on.

16. If you tell the truth, you don't have to remember anything.

17. If you drink, don't park; accidents cause people.

18. Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield.

19. Don't worry, it only seems kinky the first time.

20. Good judgment comes from bad experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment.

21. The quickest way to double your money is to fold it in half and put it back in your pocket.

22. Timing has an awful lot to do with the outcome of a rain dance.

23. A closed mouth gathers no feet.

24. Duct tape is like the force; it has a light side & a dark side, and it holds the universe together.

25. There are two theories to arguing with women. Neither one works.

26. Generally speaking, you aren't learning much when your mouth is moving.

27. Experience is something you don't get until just after you need it.

28. Never miss a good chance to shut up.

This site is getting so funny I just laugh and laugh all the time!

aha,
Trying to laugh and make a sound on the flute is a good embouchure exercise.

WHen I was in college we had a very tough band director. He was literally mean enough that some would be afraid to play for getting criticized in front of the other players. One day we were playing a stand-up concert near the town square and he was sternly directing. Directly behind him (and he was not aware of this) was a clown who was mocking his movements but the clown was on a different beat and time pattern. It was very difficult that day for us to focus on performing without laughing.