This came up in the School Jazz Bands thread and I thought I should open up a new one specifically about Benny Goodman.

I agree with Bradley, Benny Goodman is NOT the only jazz clarinetist, and it is controversial if he is even the BEST jazz clarinetist.

I honestly do not have enough respect of Goodman as a clarinetist or as a person to put him up their along with Shaw, Fountain, of Defranco. I believe Goodman was too one dimensional. He had a trademark big tone, but that was about it. His musicianship can also be questioned. HIs contributions to jazz were invaulable, however that does little to suggest he was a world-class musician.

Goodman made one of his few classical recordings at Tanglewood playing the Mozart Concerto. It was a great attempt, but falls well short of fantastic. It was too much Goodman and too little Mozart. Sounded way too student-like, not something you would expect from someone supposedly of his caliber. Not to mention the technical mistakes in what is a technically easy piece...

I feel Artie Shaw was a much better musician and overall clarinetist than Goodman. Shaw is more multi dimensional. Goodman is more of the Richard Stoltzman type (who btw is a fantastic clarinetist) but not quite at Stoltzman`s techincal level.

Bottom line from my viewpoint - Benny Goodman does not match up among the elite (Combs, Drucker, Meyer, Marcellus...)

Very true points made....

Although, you actually LIKE stolzman? I mean, honestly, playing with the double lip embouchure and all.....

Uhhh-Whats a double lip embouchure?

I said Stoltzman was a "fantastic clarinetist". He is probably among the top three most talented clarinetists in the world today, but that doesn`t mean he is anybody`s favorite nor is he the ultimate insperational musician.

Amanda, double lip embechoure is an embechoure position in which both the top AND bottom lips are curved way in. This produces a special tone but can get pretty painful.

Anyway, this thread is meant to be about Benny Goodman...not Stoltzman or embechoure.

To close out this strand of the conversation- I think he is a very talented musician. I do, really, but I just don’t really like his "talent" ( when compared to other styles as demonstrated by other top pros). To top it all off, I find in a piece we both performed when you can truly compare us two, I sound exactly like him in parts :-/ .

Maybe this is due to me playing on a big bored clarinet and yes, I do use vibrato at times.
Oh Well- I guess its good I sound like a top pro, only , why’d it have to be him??

Bradley

Perfect practice makes nearly perfect!

P.S. I can play for extended periods with a double lip embouchure and still be fine….. Is this a bad sign?? Lol

Restarting this thread...

I now own a copy of a 1967 classical music recording Benny Goodman made with the Chicago Symphony Orchestra.

He played a Carl Maria von Weber classic - the Concerto in F minor for Clarinet Opus 73.

This is so far the best classical music recording I`ve heard made by Goodman. But, still there are mistakes you wouldn`t expect from someone who is supposedly the most famous clarinetist ever.

The mistake starts of right away. Goodman`s entrance in the opening movement was about a quarter beat late and not together with the orchestra- a very amatuerish mistake.

Also, his dynamic range in this concerto was small.

The second movement got a little out of tune and it dragged a bit perhaps. I`ve heard it performed and it sounded nice and sweet, but Goodman`s rendition put me to sleep.

But there were good aspects of the recording as well. Goodman`s tone is as dark and german as I`ve ever heard him play. He almost sounded kind of Larry Combs-ish.

His tonguing and articulation was well done - especially in the closing movement.

Most peoplre can only judge by recordings and as a contrast i have been in BG`s company and must say....when you hear that sound in person it is another thing entirely and it was great...Artie Shaw was THE clarinetist for me followed by Buddy.I have heard all of them live in person on good and bad days...artie had a sound and played so musically ..He also recorded a great album of classical music on "modern Music for Clarinet" on RCA(out of print now) Ibaneze, Kabelevsky, ravel...wonderful

i agree that goodman wasnt a virtuoso clarietistand that he really in the study of music doesnt mean that much compared to the lessar known fountain with his fat sound or stoltzman with the double lip embouchouere or artie shaw with his virtuoso playing but every musician with as much prestige as the ones mentioned above have musical faults that can or cant appeal to the ear.

If you will listen to his recordings of Bartok Contrasts, Copland`s Concerto, and other works he commissions you may find renewed appreciation of him. I find he only "changed" 2 notes in the Copland.

i dont agree with you, maybe because in school all i hear about is him and all ive ever listened to was him. i think that he had a great effect on the jazz era. Also about Mozart`s concerto, music to me is about making it all your oww, its what you feel, the rules arent very clear or forced. that what i think.

The problem most people see is they try and think of BG like they would a virtuoso or a person who normally plays chamber music... Benny Goodman was neither, and that is something many can not deny... However, Benny was a good player... The thing some poeple tend to forget is that jazz is about making mistakes (even in a performance) and just making it "work"... BG did do that, and he was good at it...

Benny Goodman was definitely a good player, but a jazz player? No. My personal fav is Eddie Daniels of BIG PHAT BAND. Best tone, and control of the clarinet I have ever heard in jazz.

Who cares?
He`s made his money!!!

I know many recordings of Shaw, Goodman deFranco, Daniels, Drucker, Stoltzman and so on. And i can`t say that anyone of them has technical problems. To me they all were (and the latter are - thank God)perfect masters of their instrument. Who deserves the crown as "the best" depends only on ones personal taste.

And to Goodman`s "mistakes": I don`t think he ever had the slightest problems with his fingers. One should not forget that he simply was`nt a classical player - listening to his classical records I always had the feeling that he felt not quite comfortable with that kind of music - which is not a very good basis for playing it convincing.