hi I am a section leader in my school`s marching band. We need to work on horn angles and snaping to horns up. I figured the quickest way to solve this problem would be to take the weights off of the back. the one problem i had though was that one of my players had a king trombone. if anyone knows how to take the weight off the back of the king or has any other sugestions on how to get the horns to snap faster or fix the angles I would greatly appreciate it.

by removing the counter-weights on your horns you realize you are changing the response and tone of the horn right? just lettiong you know.


and it also depends on what year King you are talking about. My 1950 king is pretty tricky

Welding torch? Shouldn`t matter much, it`s just a King....

The counterweight actually has very little to do with the resonance of the horn. Extra weight does change the sound, but being on a brace far away from the actual air column, I would not worry about it affecting the sound. I realize what you are trying to do, to get a quicker snap, but you might also want to consider that the weight makes it easier to balance the horn in a high angle playing position. I personally would reccomend weighting the end of the slide with something in a string that will hit the ground if it isn`t held at the right angle (this doesn`t help the snapping, but it does help the angle). To get them to snap quick, it is just a matter of working to get it quick and smooth.

And Erik, you need to stop being an idiot. Yes, we know you like Bachs, which you are free to do, but they are not the only good horn. There is almost no such thing as a bad horn. All of the major manufacturers make horns that are good, and there are people who like them. Furthermore, due to poor quality control, statistically Bach probably makes more horns that are considered unplayable than any other manufacturer around. I think you will also find that there are a great number of people who realize that today, Bach is mostly a name and not actually a symbol of true quality. They used to be good horns, but the new ones are garbage. The only Bach I have ever liked was a Mt Vernon 65 G trumpet with a large bore and reverse leadpipe, in raw brass. I have never played a trombone that I liked, and I have played quite a few trombones. But some people like them, and some people like the name. If you like the Bach, play it. If you buy it for the name, you`re an idiot.

Hehehe, sorry, that was supposed to be a joke.... I know, Kings are great horns, and yeah, most Bachs off the shelf are crap. Some of the best horns I have played were Kings, specifically the 3B Silversonics. Unfortunately, some of the worst were also Kings (not counting invalid brands like Maestro, Jupiter, and Dynasty) so they gave me a bad taste in my search for "my" perfect horn.

Sorry for the confusion, just being silly.

And yeah, I searched for years for the perfect trombone, ignoring names, before I found my Edwards. No more out-of-tune production line Bachs for me. (Still like the good ones though) I do think they are far better than you lead them to be though....

I know this is an old topic, but I know a little something about King counterweights.

If your Kings are of newer vintage (i.e. the same counterweight that`s used on the newer UMI horns with the black background), you`ll find that the black "King" circle is just a decal. If you peel it off, you`ll find that the weight is attached with two screws, with probably one screw "head" on each side of the weight, so you`ll have to take off BOTH decals.

The reason I know this? I ADDED a Benge counterweight to my Benge 190f around 1991. The Benge weight and the King one are EXACTLY the same, just with different decals (the weight can be ordered at Hickey`s online where they confirm this).

The downside? If you ever want to put the weight back on, you can forget re-using the decals. You`d have to try to get your music store to order them from Conn-Selmer (don`t know if they`d make you pay for them).

Personally, I think a counterweight makes it EASIER to snap a horn up (and keep it up) as it puts the weight on the BACK rather than on the front. To each his own, though.

I`ve tried marching without a counterweight. It wasn`t fun. Hard to hold the slide level.

But on the other hand if you make your section practice with no counterweight and then put them back on during actual competitions, I`m sure everyone will easily keep their horns level `cuz they`ll have been used to not having the horn balanced.