I am looking for some insight and advice on purchasing a horn. I started playing in 8th grade, some 27 years ago (you can do the math!) and played through high school, college (music major for a bit) and have continued to play in my "grown up" years in several groups, and I play often at church as well. The horn I've been using primarily over these past 27 years is an old King that my parents bought me (for a steal at $300!) when I first started...I've looked it up by serial number and it was manufactured around 1957. It has been an excellent horn, and I've gotten many compliments on it's tone. However, it has seen a lot of abuse and wear, and after a rather unfortunate accident a couple years ago, is in need of major work and repairs. I'm in a position now where I can purchase another horn, but I'm at a bit of a loss how to decide what would be best. I played for a while in college on a Yamaha, no idea what model it was, but for the most part I've only ever played my King. I'm looking of course for a Horn that will last me the rest of my playing life, hopefully another good 27+ years. It's been suggested to me to look at a Conn 8D, any thoughts on that, or other options that might be a good fit for me? Thanks for any help you can offer!
Robynne

Here's an article that might be of help:

So, You Want to Buy A Horn

Robynne,
If you have been playing an older King I would not suggest a newer Conn 8D. Many horn players as they get older like to move to a less air consuming instrument, and if you want to get a horn for the rest of your life you might think about that aspect down the line.

The 1957 King was a great horn back then and what you had is better than any new Conn you're going to find. My suggestion to you would be to try a Yammaha 668N (nickel). The nickel 668 will have a lot of the same timbre you had with your King and will blend nicely with a section of Conns. The Yamaha has a nice even tempered scale throughout it's range which will be nice for playing in the groups you like to play in.

Hoyer's have become very popular recently, but the ones I have played recently are so heavy and I find them restrictive.But I do know someone who recently switched from an older King to a Hoyer and he is very happy.

I'm curious about the wear, tear, and damage to your King.
Send me a private message telling me more about it.

John

Hi John,
Thanks for the suggestions.
I've been researching for a while in anticipation of this purchase, but it seems there are many choices and many opinions! I was quite happy to find this forum and the link Fredrick shared was also helpful. I've been hoping for the chance to purchase a horn for years, and now that I've finally had the opportunity to make the purchase, and I nearly froze with the choices!
I was able to go to our local music shop over the weekend to see what they had for me to try, and was able to take a spin on a Yamaha 668, although it was brass not nickel, and also got to try a Conn 8D, and a Hoyer 6802. I was not at all impressed with the Yamaha...even when I took into consideration being a bit out of practice from winter hiatus it just didn't have a sound I would be happy with...nothing like what I'm used to hearing! The 8D was nice, and I really liked it, but yes it does take a lot of air. Then I tried the Hoyer, and...I just fell in love with it. Wonderful sound, and much easier to blow the high notes than on the 8D - at least it was for me, not sure if that's usual. The 8D also had really "clacky" sounding keys...is that common? Once they quoted the price on the Hoyer it was a done deal, so I am now the proud owner of a Hoyer 6802 (nickel silver). I cannot wait to take it for a real test in a couple weeks when our new season starts up.
Just a bit of mild anxiety left now, regarding if I make the right choice, but that would be the case regardless of what I'd bought.
Thanks again! I may keep hanging around here a bit...it's always nice to keep up with other horn players.

Robynne

John,

Sorry, being new here I wasn't sure how to private message you.
As to the problems with my King... Keeping in mind I started playing it when I was 13, so the usual dents and dings associated with being owned by a klutzy young teen but beyond that, I've had some problems with some of the connections and solderings coming loose on it over the years. It has been in for repairs a few times, but it doesn't hold for more than a few years. A couple years ago, it got flipped out of the back of our van (we were on an incline, the back hatch was opened and the horn in it's case just tumbled)...I hoped for the best, and at first didn't realize the damage other than a bit of a dent at the point of impact, but when I got to play on it later, found that not only had several solderings been knocked loose, and several connections also, but the entire horn seemed out of alignment. The main tuning slides are now misaligned also. I've had to keep playing on it...well, if I wanted to keep playing...it was play on it or quit until I could afford repairs or replace it. I didn't want to do a patch job on it, it needs so much work now that I wanted to do it right and really get it taken care of. I think it is a testament to what a great horn it is that I was able to keep playing it and still make an acceptable sound, but I've felt for the past year at least, that I've been fighting it to make it work for me. I know I should have taken it in some time ago for work, but either didn't have the time or the money, or both, to get it done. Things fell together this year and I made the choice to replace at this time rather than repair, but you know, I feel a little disloyal to my poor King, replacing it. Silly? Maybe. Maybe not. I'm hoping to be able to eventually take the King in and get it overhauled, refurbished...made whole again. After playing on it for the past 27 years, I can't imagine not having it.

Robynne

You will probably love your Hoyer. They seem to be very popular right now.
Regarding the 8D, yes the valves are way more noisy than they should be. I don't like the 668 in brass either, the nickel seem to sound nice. But don't worry even though I don't like the Hoyers, evetyone I know who has gotten one loves them.

regarding your King, it's a nice horn. But when those solder joints come loose it's sometimes because of an alignment issue. And everything needs to be aligned correctly or it keeps happening.

Have fun with your new horn!

Some of my horn solders have come loose... (I was planning on sending it away for general repairs next week) Is this because there is something seriously wrong? Or just minor mistreatment by previous owners (the joints were like that before I started using it)

I am happy to hear you are so pleased with your Hoyer! I play on a Hans Hoyer 6801NSA purchased from Patterson Hornworks. Jim Patterson is an incredible horn artisan and if you ever have some extra spending money (although who does these days), I encourage you to check out his website. He can perform various fine tunings and adjustments to your horn (especially Hoyers and Conns) that make a huge difference. If you love your Hoyer now, you won't believe what it sounds like after going through one of his conversions! Just a thought

@ Rumble -- There is a good chance the solder joints have come loose from a long time of "not the best care". Not necessarily abuse, certainly not intentional abuse but ignorance and avoidance. Often times when something comes loose like a solder joint the first line of repair is to solder it back in place. Seldom does a repair technician ask what may have happened. If they bend or force anything into place and then solder it you are putting undue stress on the intrument and that same joint or another one will pop sometime in the future because of the unbalanced stress. Then that one gets repaired and another joint pops, and it continues and snowballs.

There are specific specs for what should be where, but many of these specifications are proprietary. When I solder joints and parts together I make sure they fit naturally before I solder the joint. If I have to hold it in place while soldering it, then that means there is something wrong somewhere else.

What part of the country do you live in(just the State name should work)? I might be able to recoomend someone for you.If you are going to repair the horn you might want to consider having it taken completely apart and then soldered back together one joint at a time. You might also check your case; there should be a minimal amount of pressure on the horn at just the correct place if there is too much pressure holding it in or pressure in the wrong place you will be adding too much stress to the wrong places. All my cases are either original or custom fit to the specific Horn.

As mentioned above James Patterson is very good at disassembly and reassembly and he understands the King Specs. BUt there are a few others as well.

Thanks Csulli...I have actually browsed a bit on that site recently. I'll keep it in mind if I get to the point where I have that extra spending money.
Our spring season starts in 2 weeks...I'll have to report back how the Hoyer sounds with the section and with the group as a whole.

Robynne

@ John - I'm not sure that you'll be able to recommend anyone, sorry...! I live in Australia, Victoria!

What you said makes sense, and I will certainly have a look at my case. It has always struck me as a good case though, because its very sturdy and protective. I will have a closer look at the fit though.

Thanks very much

@rumble - - contact Peter Luff at Griffith Universitys Queensland conservatorium.

p.luff@griffith.edu.au

He is a great horn player, teacher, and lecturer AND he takes very good care of his instruments. So he might know a good repair person in your area. And he is a super nice top notch fellow.

Thanks for that - I'll get straight onto him!!

One more wise crack about horns. Just about any horn you can buy today is better than just about any horn that was available 100 years ago. There were some highly accomplished masters of the horn playing those inferior instrument of yester year. Remember this important truth:

It's not the horn that makes the music, it's the hornist.

Practice, practice, practice! )

Valerie Wells
http://bebabe.wordpress.com/